75,000 less suckler calves this year.
- Thread starter marco
- Start date
thats a bit of a drop, is there a european decline ?
or has there been an increase in dairy calves to balance this
bruceythom
Well-Known Member
I blame the SFP for that, pay out regardless of the animals being there or not. If a farmer had to have the animals there up to his reference year to draw the full payment, I'll bet that the drop would be very small if at all.
Posted from the Ham Bone using Crapatalk 2
But thats just as bad as bringing back subs for animals, you'd just end up with the farmers producing calves for the sake of it.
Anyways, no great loss in my view, its well known that sucklers are unprofitable for the vast majority of farmers, why is it any surprise that we have wayy less of them ha. Anyways, do away with the SFP totally, push contract rearing and weanling to beef for any of the non dairy livestock farmers, and let the market dictate what happens.
nashmach
Well-Known Member
You might change your tune come 2016...:whistling:
The facts are obvious, after last year's dreadful weather, many farmers culled hard rather than feeding cows. This was going to lead to a natural decrease in numbers.
Couple this with many cows in poor condition which probably didn't help the breeding season for most either.
TMKF
Well-Known Member
That reflects a lot of what my vet was saying.
He also pointed out a lot of beef heifers that had gone too far in the finishing process, used instead of old cows, suddenly put in calf because calf price was so high. As you would expect he was seeing a lot of nightmare calving cos they had used terminal huge sires and that mixed with poor nutrition would lead to a drop in suckler calving due to sheer mortality
gone
Well-Known Member
It's very hard to make money out of sucklers and as many found out last year the few Marginal cows in the herd really cost money to have, be that the few extra cows that bring you to a marginal socking rate and mean you have to feed extra to them all and use extra Fert to graze them, or more likely those few old or middling cows that have been tolerated up to now.
Peter
Well-Known Member
Was overstocked here and with silage scarce last year i decided to sell some of my fattening cattle instead of finishing them i that I got on better i felt in the mart than keeping them for three months longer and buying exspensive feed for them !
I halved the number of suckler cows that I had in the past year and the labour and feed savings have been unbelievable
robbie c
Well-Known Member
We have done the same, but then we let a good few go every. 3 or 4 yrs , sort of way to hold money, build them up and then off load them
diesel power
Well-Known Member
75,000 less might well be only 3. something percent but it's still a huge number. If it does something similar next year and the year after and so on it's going to be a disaster.
Peter
Well-Known Member
Well i just didnt have enough land to carry them all,had to empty the tanks 5 times last year only twice this year
nashmach
Well-Known Member
The only thing is exports may be way back so net number in the country still the same.
bruceythom
Well-Known Member
So does all this mean that there's going to be strong market for jersey bull calves? 150000 to make up for the 75,000 suckler calves?
Posted from the Ham Bone using Crapatalk 2
Posted from the Ham Bone using Crapatalk 2
Merv_B
Well-Known Member
Surely that will depend on what part of the food chain you are in ie with a suckler herd rearing calves to sell at the mart or at the other end buying stores to bring to slaughter. More demand for fewer animals will surely help push the price up, although this may not be reflected in what the factories are offering for the end product.
Will farmers simply look at sourcing calves or youngstock from other countries if there is not enough supply from the national herd?
It is a bit like the horse market, there is no point breeding stock if there is no outlet for it and you then end up selling the animals at a loss.
sheep farmer
Well-Known Member
regading the drop in calf numbers, i was on a farm today that had 65 jersey cross bull weanlings.the worst dirt on gods earth how any person can call themself a farmer with them, let alone say he was a beef farmer.
two years ago one of the big local dairy farmers was getting the knackery to call once a week to dispose of his jex bull calves at the cost of 15 euro a head, this spring he was getting 80 to 120 a head for them out of the yard and said he could not believe his luck.
and as for importing calves,just look at the fellas that bought the uk bull calf and the amount of losses and now trying to get a factory to take them, a total disaster compared to the irish fr calf.
the only good thing for the beef man is thank god for wicklow cattle company and debuitlearr who take so much of this rubbish out to holland.and one last thing jack kennedy has a lot to answer for pushing jersey cross.
two years ago one of the big local dairy farmers was getting the knackery to call once a week to dispose of his jex bull calves at the cost of 15 euro a head, this spring he was getting 80 to 120 a head for them out of the yard and said he could not believe his luck.
and as for importing calves,just look at the fellas that bought the uk bull calf and the amount of losses and now trying to get a factory to take them, a total disaster compared to the irish fr calf.
the only good thing for the beef man is thank god for wicklow cattle company and debuitlearr who take so much of this rubbish out to holland.and one last thing jack kennedy has a lot to answer for pushing jersey cross.
diesel power
Well-Known Member
Thats not necessarily a good thing either in that the factories are well aware of stock no.'s in the country and they will then pay what they like. It's a vicious circle.
nashmach
Well-Known Member
Excellent point and well made, not only on the UK calves but what about the German and Romanian ones too!
bruceythom
Well-Known Member
I don't think Jack Kennedy could be blamed for a drop in suckler calf numbers, Shur he's a dairy journalist.
If enough money was paid for bull calves from dairy cows, dairy farmers would use more beefy breeds, British/holstein herd here, have gotten anything from 40euro to 300 euro at 6 weeks old in the last few years where a high EBI heifer will readily make 400 year after year. At 40 euro I'd have been better off giving the knacker the 15 euro to collect him at a few days old. Unless us dairy farmers have 3/4 bred charlaois friesan bull calves, we won't have satisfactory bulls to make up for the declining suckler calf numbers. It's not the dairy farmers fault that the beef industry is where it is, it's a combination of a cartel of factories and the SFP that has it where it is. Dont be looking at the dairy industry to form a solution. I get an education by beef farmers occasionally as to how I should be breeding my own herd to cesarean sections and longer calving intervals so I can produce milk from silage with fat, low yielding British friesan cows all year round.
I'm sorry, nerve hit, rant over. :D:D
Posted from the Ham Bone using Crapatalk 2
With the current milk prices, and the fact that a good 8000L cow can knock out over 3grand worth of milk in a year, why the hell would we give a toss about trying to achieve an extra 100/200quid for a beef calf, when as a result of what Bruce talked about, say having a C-section might reduced that cows milk production by say 2000L, or 800quid, the sums just never add up for the risks involved. Anything other than replacement calves from a dairyherd will always be a byproduct, simple as is.
ithastopay
Well-Known Member
Home truths there by Tim and brucey, as a beef farmer with all animals bought in, I'm not one bit worried about the decline in numbers, nor would I tell any dairy farmer how to farm, as ye said the calf is a by product of milk production, the calf will be availble for a beef man to buy and try to turn a profit on, the price will be set by the buyer, as they have to make a profit too, there is too much worrying about the declining numbers, nobody is considering the fall in the number of finishers, it is the tightest game to be in, farmers may switch to rearing stock or providing feed for dairy farms or convert their farm to dairying, banks see dairy as the most profitable enterprise, stocking loans are been cut to beef farmers, there will be less farmers to buy cattle in a few years time. There will be money made for anyone who sticks at it and does their job well. A rising tide lifts all boats.
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limerick man
Well-Known Member
Would jersey cows average 8000L
Pure bred US one might knock out double!
limerick man
Well-Known Member
Ya US with proper feeding, breeding and a helping hand. Our national average is way below that,thought it was closer to 5000l.