Glyphosate and potential ban

L

Louis mc

Well-Known Member
There's no point trying to be polite about this.

Farmers would want cop the f*^k on the sharpish. Here we have an example of totally irresponsible use of glyphosate putting the the rest of us at risk of losing a vital tool in our farming armoury. Then you post it on a public forum almost proud of it.

If we lose glyphosate farmers will have no one to blame but themselves.

I'm not saying there's anything hugely dangerous about glyphosate, I think and hope it's pretty safe in the scheme of things. The problem is there is huge concern amongst the general public about its safety and that's all that Matters. We could easily live with out pre harvest glyph, take it way as a cheap out of crop herb and it would be a right pain in the arse.

I'm not claiming to be perfect or to be entitled to tell everyone what to do but I feel someone needs to be proactive and try protect out future.
 
Russia is conducting Military manouvres on the borders of Poland and the Baltic states . The bellies of Europe are full but their brains have short memories . We are producing food for people that drive the best cars and use the most modern technology civilisation has ever experienced . The powers that be and the Glitterati that run the world are happy to see the great unwashed worry about Roundup in the food chain while they plan the next global disaster .
There is intense pressure to reduce chemicals in growing crops but less pressure to reduce the chemicals that keep your bread white and mold free . Roundup is a great product but an easy target and we have to do our utmost to protect it .
 
gone said:
There are much more dangerous practices in agriculture than pre harvest glypho, but we will probably lose it because of mass hysteria. It still is perfectly legal and safe. I have vastly reduced the amount of pre harvest glypho I use and no longer even consider it for crops that may end up being used for human consumption, but will continue to use it on crops for animal feed.
The same lobby that want to ban glypho also want to ban fert and all other chemicals, should we stop posting pics of these as well?
Most ferts and most other tillage chems are proven to be way more dangerous than glypho.
If you have spread N or P, sprayed insecticide or fungicide you have done far more dangerous things to the food chain.
I don't think it is wise for us to start a witch hunt on ill informed grounds and on other lobby groups behalf, it is still legal and still safe.
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Agree but we have be proactive about it. Glyphosate is under fire at the minute we need to do everything demonstrate we are responsible users. Even if a chemical is totally "safe" if you survey consumers they will not to applied to crops 10 days before harvest. The consumer is the only thing that matters in this. It's not good enough to sit back and say what I'm doing today is perfectly legal and give 2 fingers to the establishment. This is not a witch hunt it's about responsible use, best practice, boosting public confidence and having the balls to speak up if you think a fellow farmer is doing something that you don't agree with.
 
Louis mc said:
Agree but we have be proactive about it. Glyphosate is under fire at the minute we need to do everything demonstrate we are responsible users. Even if a chemical is totally "safe" if you survey consumers they will not to applied to crops 10 days before harvest. The consumer is the only thing that matters in this. It's not good enough to sit back and say what I'm doing today is perfectly legal and give 2 fingers to the establishment. This is not a witch hunt it's about responsible use, best practice, boosting public confidence and having the balls to speak up if you think a fellow farmer is doing something that you don't agree with.
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Balls to speak up has nothing to do with this, I'd be pretty sure that if I saw the way you were doing things that I would not agree with them but I wouldn't dare give out or pull you up on its because it's your choice what you do with your farm and i wouldn't take it too kindly to be pulled up by you or anyone else as to my farming practices. I'd reckon 10% max of crops in Ireland are sprayed pre harvest, no malting barley is done or food grade oats either, lads generally don't spray for the craic as it costs money and is unnecessary, it's the UK that have the big issue with pre harvest glyphosate and they could use it God only knows how many times for blackgrass control. Plenty lads spread slurry during the closed period, they put out P on winter grain in late September and October which is not allowed also, the public see this going on too but I don't think I'd pull anyone up on this as it's their own baby if they get caught.
 
My thoughts on prev harvest glyphosphate is that you get more value for money in terms of weed control if preharvest rather than bare stubble. Also can drop moisture a bit, easier cutting and make straw easier to handle.
Some largescale min till lads are using glyphosphate 3 times a year. How is that better than a plough based small farmer putting out his once yearly application preharvest to get best bang for his buck and make life a bit easier??
There's barley being landed right now at ports and who knows what chemicals have been applied to it. Makes our quality assurance etc a nonsense
 
I sprayed off 10 acres of grass for a dairy farmer during the wk pre grazing. He was goin in grazing 5-7 days after. I asked him would he drink the milk after its grazed he said no way. But it seemed to be ok for everyone else to drink it I taught to myself. They shouldn't be allowed spray it pre graze . It got a fair dose of it and plenty of doubling around the headlands
 
6600 said:
My thoughts on prev harvest glyphosphate is that you get more value for money in terms of weed control if preharvest rather than bare stubble. Also can drop moisture a bit, easier cutting and make straw easier to handle.
Some largescale min till lads are using glyphosphate 3 times a year. How is that better than a plough based small farmer putting out his once yearly application preharvest to get best bang for his buck and make life a bit easier??
There's barley being landed right now at ports and who knows what chemicals have been applied to it. Makes our quality assurance etc a nonsense
Click to expand...

Min till does not mean large amounts of roundup are used . My usage is usually around 2L / ha across the whole farm . All fields get 1L /ha and some might get 3L /ha . Any roundup resistant weeds get a run of the Horsch @ 15KPH to freshen up the ground . I did not pre harvest any cereals last autumn . I pre harvested 50% of my Oats in 2014 because I wanted to give myself more time to harvest and clean up a more moory party of the field . I reckon three years out of five I would grow Oats with no weed control of any sort . Unfortunately because of our Atlantic climate we would use a lot of Fungicides . I farmed before Roundup was invented and it is a superior product to TCA and the window of opportunities to use it are far wider . Pre Harvest is an option I am prepared to lose but it might mean I need a bigger combine .
 
I rarely have any tillage any more , but use it strong 3 lts /ac when reseeding I believe it saves 10 to 15 lts of diesel / ac. my father used to tell me about reseeding in his day tilling the field three times three weeks apart using a triple k .He probably needed the three weeks to pick stones,but it was to allow the weeds to germinate hopefully we won`t go back there.
 
Well, I've been watching this thread during the day in between doing jobs on machinery in the shed (bloody drizzle all day but got lots done). Not sure I can add anything except summarise my thoughts;

As tillage farmers, we are in very dangerous times. Our incomes are under pressure, harvest yields are disappointing and prices are very poor relative to our cost base.

We need to work together in every way, be that exchanging knowledge, using our collective voice to let the politicians know our plight or even giving each other a shoulder to cry on by talking to each other.

There are excellent points made in every single post since Jonny1's picture of his wheat. I know Jonny with some years and would describe him as an excellent farmer, certainly not one to waste money or the environment.
I would feel that while well founded, Louis's approach was a bit harsh and over the top.

That said, Louis has made a very good point. It is in all our interests to protect our industry by portraying it in the best and most professional manner. Be that a tidy farm yard, well maintained lands, careful use of the public highways or responsible use of agro chemicals and slurries.

As someone who is involved in the sale of a lot of Glyphosate, I certainly believe that the use of the chemical on silage before it is cut, grass prior to grazing or cereals just to speed up the combine are all uses that we can do without or at least minimise. Granted there are times when a dirty or lodged cereal crop will really benefit from its use, but the use on grass land as described above is to my mind completely needless and looking for trouble from a residue and image point of view.

If we all took the approach of not doing anything to our produce that would make us not want to eat the end product produced by that produce then we would go a long way to ensuring food safety from the farmers point of view (withdrawl periods for medicines, pre-harvest chemicals, vermin in grains, etc.).

We can give out about and criticise the anti capitalist, full bellied anti-modern farming people in our world but they exist and we need to be clever in how we take them on. As farmers, we will have people who can fight our battles at EU level (MEP's, Farmer representatives, Industry lobbyists) but we can and must all do our bit to paint the right image on our own farms every single day.
 
I am falling down on the side of we should not use pre harvest glyphosate, we all know its a very useful tool, but that is not in any way the point, we can write posts after posts about this situation or another or controlling this weed or that weed but it is missing the point completely. As Louis says its the consumer who matters here, and I am also not suggesting glyphosate is dangerous, but preception is everything. Putting pesticides on crops 7 days pre harvest gives us a very bad image simple as, nothing else matters.

I look at this conversation in simple terms and could be wrong, if we use it pre harvest and residues show in food it will be banned, if we only use it after the combine, residues will not be an issue and it is alot less likely to be banned. There are more people out there want it banned than want to keep it, so we must not give them amo to shoot us with.

What does matter to us is we keep this product to clean up stubbles etc. Also any min till lads doing 3 applications per year need to kop on and learn about rotations and stop looking for bottles to cure their problems. We use between 1-1.5/l ha /year here pre drilling. I did use it on my OSR this year which will only be acceptible into the future in my head if the rapeseed is for biodiesel use not food, hope there are some swathers in the country next year.

By the way from what ive heard this conversation may be pointless, may be banned pre harvest next year anyway, that may only be gossip tho, and to be honest i kind of hope it is, farmers sometimes need saving from themselves! harsh but true!
 
Always Thinking said:
I am falling down on the side of we should not use pre harvest glyphosate, we all know its a very useful tool, but that is not in any way the point, we can write posts after posts about this situation or another or controlling this weed or that weed but it is missing the point completely. As Louis says its the consumer who matters here, and I am also not suggesting glyphosate is dangerous, but preception is everything. Putting pesticides on crops 7 days pre harvest gives us a very bad image simple as, nothing else matters.

I look at this conversation in simple terms and could be wrong, if we use it pre harvest and residues show in food it will be banned, if we only use it after the combine, residues will not be an issue and it is alot less likely to be banned. There are more people out there want it banned than want to keep it, so we must not give them amo to shoot us with.

What does matter to us is we keep this product to clean up stubbles etc. Also any min till lads doing 3 applications per year need to kop on and learn about rotations and stop looking for bottles to cure their problems. We use between 1-1.5/l ha /year here pre drilling. I did use it on my OSR this year which will only be acceptible into the future in my head if the rapeseed is for biodiesel use not food, hope there are some swathers in the country next year.

By the way from what ive heard this conversation may be pointless, may be banned pre harvest next year anyway, that may only be gossip tho, and to be honest i kind of hope it is, farmers sometimes need saving from themselves! harsh but true!
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Agreed 100%.
 
The majority of consumers have no problem with chemicals in their food. If they had they would purchase organic, purchase local in season, Purchase quality assured etc.
The majority of consumers purchase the cheapest or the product with the best advertising /perceived image.
The anti glypho camp has strong publicity at present, so we must treat them with kid gloves.

PS. We farmers are no different, If we were prepared to pay extra for a ration with Irish ingredients, the mills would compete for our grains rather than import.....
 
I've been following this thread with some interest . I have to say I also fall into the no preharvest roundup camp. Saying "ah sure tis only animal feed" is crap imo. Sure isn't that animal eventually going to end up on the dinner table or produce milk and residues won't stay in the animals feet. Consumers are very fickle and the tiniest thing sends them into a panic. If food was scarce it wouldn't matter but the Wests bellies are full and they don;t care one jot for the farmer. It's in all our interests regardless if the enterprise we're in to portray a good clean environmental picture.
 
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Well it seems that picture I posted has caused some controversy around this forum and somehow single- handedly I am going to get glyphosate banned in Europe.
I have been called reckless, irresponsible and depicted as some type of idiot peasant who is almost proud of my crime against humanity.
Maybe all these things are true but hopefully (moderators) I will have the right of reply here.
Its going to be a long reply using pictures where necessary to show what we are at here on this farm.
As you are all well aware farming is going through some difficult financial times at the minute and arable farming especially has seen poor returns on investment for quite a few years now.
With this in mind we tried to devise a system here where we could grow good crops at a cost that would leave some kind of profit without compromising food safety or damage to the environment. We briefly looked at the organic route but rightly or wrongly thought we would be gone broke before we got that up and running as the conversion time would take too long.
So we decided to stick to the conventional route with a plough based system (didn't have the courage to go min till) growing winter wheat, winter barley, spring barley and oilseed rape/spring oats as break crops. It was decided to chop most or all of the straw, incorporate it immediately after harvest let stubbles green up and then plough and plant winter crops or leave the greened up fields for spring cropping over the winter and plough in early spring.
Fertilizer and chemical inputs were to be tailored to give us our 5 year average crop yields and we have used an agronomist from our chemical supplier to advise on the best inputs to achieve these targets.
Machinery investment was going to be almost nil apart from normal servicing and maintenance and we would do all our own work bar lime spreading and hedge cutting.
Our ageing combine which has an output of 12-14 tons per hour (our own figures) it probably had a book output of 18-20tph which under ideal conditions it might achieve but not in Ireland. We figured out that we would get 10 to 12 cutting days during the harvest period to cut our crops so needed to maximise the machines out put to cut all our crops at optimum moistures (20%) as we didn't have drying facilities. I had a farmer friend in the north of England which has a climate similar to our area and asked him what way they managed their harvest. He informed me that they sprayed all their crops pre harvest with
and that
1: It gave them a longer working day (early start, late finish)
2:Grain moisture was always lower than on non treated crops typically 1 to 2% lower
3: The chopped straw broke quicker when incorporated after harvest.
4: Scutch grass control was much better and cheaper(due to lower application rates)
This seemed like a plan to us as we have a lot of trees surrounding our fields see pictures



These trees although lovely to look at and great to negate our carbon emissions cause a lot of uneven ripening on headlands so the Glyphosate makes a great job of evening up the ripening process.
There is also a problem on our heavier land with meadow grass starting to grow late in the season and making it difficult to start harvesting early in the day or late into the evening with dew

Meadow grass in winter wheat.
We also seem to have a problem in spring barley with late green tillers which our merchant wasn't too happy with as it spoiled the sample until we went the pre harvest treatment route

I know this post has most of you bored by now but to summarise
1litre of Glyphosate/Ha is used pre harvest on all cereals and non thereafter
3.5 litres Glyphosate is used on OSR
I am well aware of the bru ha ha surrounding glyphosate usage at the minute and have done some research in the matter I have spoken with T.D's and MEP's and all they do is nod sympathetically and deep down you know they are going to go with the anti mob because they probably haven't the balls or knowledge on the matter to argue a case for us.
Its good to see a few of you are pro active on this matter so I am expecting a flurry of letters to the Farmers Journal next week from you following the editor Matt Dempseys column this week which really helps farmers image with the public if you can't read the attached check out the Journal

I am with @gone here in that I will continue to use preharvest glyphosate and if you read the link to this article you may see why
http://www.wired.com/2016/05/monsantos-roundup-herbicide-cause-cancer-not-controversy-explained/
I also believe that as farmers we all handle products a lot more dangerous than glyphosate so in your spare time google what ever it is you used last and see what turns up
In this era of mass hysteria check out this link and see what a crazy headline can do
http://scienceblog.cancerresearchuk...definitely-cause-cancer-should-we-be-worried/
I have more links to glyphosate use that I may post later
Thanks for all your input I wouldn't worry about the public they are only led by the nose by the media and will never be satisfied and appeasement is only oxygen for them. Remember this is the same public that throw their filthy rubbish over our hedgerows and poison themselves and their children with salted and sugared rubbish
Thanks to @CORK @gone @6600 @Blackwater boy and anyone that gave reasonable debate here and @nashmach for noticing my new exhaust
P.S. I am not almost proud of what I posted I am very proud of my ancestors who have farmed here since 1730 I am proud of my 2 sons who help out here
I am proud of the way we farm and anyone is welcome to come visit us and see what we are at and finally I am proud of my friends on this forum who have stuck their neck out for me when it could have been easier join in the "witch hunt"
John O' Neill
 
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jonny1 said:
Well it seems that picture I posted has caused some controversy around this forum and somehow single- handedly I am going to get glyphosate banned in Europe.
I have been called reckless, irresponsible and depicted as some type of idiot peasant who is almost proud of my crime against humanity.
Maybe all these things are true but hopefully (moderators) I will have the right of reply here.
Its going to be a long reply using pictures where necessary to show what we are at here on this farm.
As you are all well aware farming is going through some difficult financial times at the minute and arable farming especially has seen poor returns on investment for quite a few years now.
With this in mind we tried to devise a system here where we could grow good crops at a cost that would leave some kind of profit without compromising food safety or damage to the environment. We briefly looked at the organic route but rightly or wrongly thought we would be gone broke before we got that up and running as the conversion time would take too long.
So we decided to stick to the conventional route with a plough based system (didn't have the courage to go min till) growing winter wheat, winter barley, spring barley and oilseed rape/spring oats as break crops. It was decided to chop most or all of the straw, incorporate it immediately after harvest let stubbles green up and then plough and plant winter crops or leave the greened up fields for spring cropping over the winter and plough in early spring.
Fertilizer and chemical inputs were to be tailored to give us our 5 year average crop yields and we have used an agronomist from our chemical supplier to advise on the best inputs to achieve these targets.
Machinery investment was going to be almost nil apart from normal servicing and maintenance and we would do all our own work bar lime spreading and hedge cutting.
Our ageing combine which has an output of 12-14 tons per hour (our own figures) it probably had a book output of 18-20tph which under ideal conditions it might achieve but not in Ireland. We figured out that we would get 10 to 12 cutting days during the harvest period to cut our crops so needed to maximise the machines out put to cut all our crops cut at optimum moistures (20%) as we didn't have drying facilities. I had a farmer friend in the north of England which has a climate similar to our area and asked him what way they managed their harvest. He informed me that they sprayed all their crops pre harvest with
and that
1: It gave them a longer working day (early start, late finish)
2:Grain moisture was always lower than on non treated crops typically 1 to 2% lower
3: The chopped straw broke quicker when incorporated after harvest.
4: Scutch grass control was much better and cheaper(due to lower application rates)
This seemed like a plan to us as we have a lot of trees surrounding our fields see pictures



These trees although lovely to look at and great to negate our carbon emissions cause a lot of uneven ripening on headlands so the Glyphosate makes a great job of evening up the ripening process.
There is also a problem on our heavier land with meadow grass starting to grow late in the season and making it difficult to start harvesting early in the day or late into the evening with dew

Meadow grass in winter wheat.
We also seem to have a problem in spring barley with late green tillers which our merchant wasn't too happy with as it spoiled the sample until we went the pre harvest treatment route

I know this post has most of you bored by now but to summarise
1litre of Glyphosate/Ha is used pre harvest on all cereals and non thereafter
3.5 litres Glyphosate is used on OSR
I am well aware of the bru ha ha surrounding glyphosate usage at the minute and have done some research in the matter I have spoken with T.D's and MEP's and all they do is nod sympathetically and deep down you know they are going to go with the anti mob because they probably haven't the balls or knowledge on the matter to argue a case for us.
Its good to see a few of you are pro active on this matter so I am expecting a flurry of letters to the Farmers Journal next week from you following the editor Matt Dempseys column this week which really helps farmers image with the public if you can't read the attached check out the Journal

I am with @gone here in that I will continue to use preharvest glyphosate and if you read the link to this article you may see why
http://www.wired.com/2016/05/monsantos-roundup-herbicide-cause-cancer-not-controversy-explained/
I also believe that as farmers we all handle products a lot more dangerous than glyphosate so in your spare time google what ever it is you used last and see what turns up
In this era of mass hysteria check out this link and see what a crazy headline can dohttp://scienceblog.cancerresearchuk.org/2012/06/14/diesel-fumes-definitely-cause-cancer-should-we-be-worried/
I have more links to glyphosate use that I may post later
Thanks for all your input I wouldn't worry about the public they are only led by the nose by the media and will never be satisfied and appeasement is only oxygen for them.
Thanks to @CORK @gone @6600 @Blackwater boy and anyone that gave reasonable debate here and @nashmach for noticing my new exhaust
P.S. I am not almost proud of what I posted I am very proud of my ancestors who have farmed here since 1730 I am proud of my 2 sons who help out here
I am proud of the way we farm and anyone is welcome to come visit us and see what we are at and finally I am proud of my friends on this forum who have stuck their neck out for me when it could have been easier join in the "witch hunt"
John O' Neill
Click to expand...

Well said
 
@jonny1 I certainly didn't mean my post above to seem cutting at you. I was thinking of that dairy farmer mentioned in an earlier post that intended to graze a burnt off pasture and lads who don't adhere to the time frame before cutting a crop treated with roundup. God knows I'm far from perfect myself and your post is an excellent one.
 
jonny1 said:
Well it seems that picture I posted has caused some controversy around this forum and somehow single- handedly I am going to get glyphosate banned in Europe.
I have been called reckless, irresponsible and depicted as some type of idiot peasant who is almost proud of my crime against humanity.
Maybe all these things are true but hopefully (moderators) I will have the right of reply here.
Its going to be a long reply using pictures where necessary to show what we are at here on this farm.
As you are all well aware farming is going through some difficult financial times at the minute and arable farming especially has seen poor returns on investment for quite a few years now.
With this in mind we tried to devise a system here where we could grow good crops at a cost that would leave some kind of profit without compromising food safety or damage to the environment. We briefly looked at the organic route but rightly or wrongly thought we would be gone broke before we got that up and running as the conversion time would take too long.
So we decided to stick to the conventional route with a plough based system (didn't have the courage to go min till) growing winter wheat, winter barley, spring barley and oilseed rape/spring oats as break crops. It was decided to chop most or all of the straw, incorporate it immediately after harvest let stubbles green up and then plough and plant winter crops or leave the greened up fields for spring cropping over the winter and plough in early spring.
Fertilizer and chemical inputs were to be tailored to give us our 5 year average crop yields and we have used an agronomist from our chemical supplier to advise on the best inputs to achieve these targets.
Machinery investment was going to be almost nil apart from normal servicing and maintenance and we would do all our own work bar lime spreading and hedge cutting.
Our ageing combine which has an output of 12-14 tons per hour (our own figures) it probably had a book output of 18-20tph which under ideal conditions it might achieve but not in Ireland. We figured out that we would get 10 to 12 cutting days during the harvest period to cut our crops so needed to maximise the machines out put to cut all our crops at optimum moistures (20%) as we didn't have drying facilities. I had a farmer friend in the north of England which has a climate similar to our area and asked him what way they managed their harvest. He informed me that they sprayed all their crops pre harvest with
and that
1: It gave them a longer working day (early start, late finish)
2:Grain moisture was always lower than on non treated crops typically 1 to 2% lower
3: The chopped straw broke quicker when incorporated after harvest.
4: Scutch grass control was much better and cheaper(due to lower application rates)
This seemed like a plan to us as we have a lot of trees surrounding our fields see pictures



These trees although lovely to look at and great to negate our carbon emissions cause a lot of uneven ripening on headlands so the Glyphosate makes a great job of evening up the ripening process.
There is also a problem on our heavier land with meadow grass starting to grow late in the season and making it difficult to start harvesting early in the day or late into the evening with dew

Meadow grass in winter wheat.
We also seem to have a problem in spring barley with late green tillers which our merchant wasn't too happy with as it spoiled the sample until we went the pre harvest treatment route

I know this post has most of you bored by now but to summarise
1litre of Glyphosate/Ha is used pre harvest on all cereals and non thereafter
3.5 litres Glyphosate is used on OSR
I am well aware of the bru ha ha surrounding glyphosate usage at the minute and have done some research in the matter I have spoken with T.D's and MEP's and all they do is nod sympathetically and deep down you know they are going to go with the anti mob because they probably haven't the balls or knowledge on the matter to argue a case for us.
Its good to see a few of you are pro active on this matter so I am expecting a flurry of letters to the Farmers Journal next week from you following the editor Matt Dempseys column this week which really helps farmers image with the public if you can't read the attached check out the Journal

I am with @gone here in that I will continue to use preharvest glyphosate and if you read the link to this article you may see why
http://www.wired.com/2016/05/monsantos-roundup-herbicide-cause-cancer-not-controversy-explained/
I also believe that as farmers we all handle products a lot more dangerous than glyphosate so in your spare time google what ever it is you used last and see what turns up
In this era of mass hysteria check out this link and see what a crazy headline can do
http://scienceblog.cancerresearchuk...definitely-cause-cancer-should-we-be-worried/
I have more links to glyphosate use that I may post later
Thanks for all your input I wouldn't worry about the public they are only led by the nose by the media and will never be satisfied and appeasement is only oxygen for them. Remember this is the same public that throw their filthy rubbish over our hedgerows and poison themselves and their children with salted and sugared rubbish
Thanks to @CORK @gone @6600 @Blackwater boy and anyone that gave reasonable debate here and @nashmach for noticing my new exhaust
P.S. I am not almost proud of what I posted I am very proud of my ancestors who have farmed here since 1730 I am proud of my 2 sons who help out here
I am proud of the way we farm and anyone is welcome to come visit us and see what we are at and finally I am proud of my friends on this forum who have stuck their neck out for me when it could have been easier join in the "witch hunt"
John O' Neill
Click to expand...
That's one of the best posts I've seen on this forum for a long time.
 
There are some great posts in here.
I'm going to suggest that the posts relating to glyphosate be moved to a new thread, might it also be better to have it in the members only area?

As tillage farmers. We must remain united.
We are a very small group numerically,
"United we stand divided we fall" "divide and conquer" and all that stuff.

Perhaps I'm reading a bit much into it, it appears to me that min till, direct drill prationeers are willing to give up on pre harvest use, in order to prevent an all out ban, maybe ye are correct and that battle is lost, though I don't believe it will serve any of us well, if we are to accept a ban on pre harvest too easily.
We must not become divided, no matter what the outcome.
If there were to be an all out ban on glyphosate in Europe the next step must be.

A ban on all food imports from jurisdictions where it's use is permitted.

For that we will need strong United lobbing from farmers all over Europe.
Needless to say, grain traders and shippers would not agree.
 
I remember the same discussion about Ralgro and Finaplix which were growth promoters that we were legally allowed inject into cattle . They as far as I know are still allowed in the USA and the American FDA are fairly strict . It was phased out here at a tremendous loss to farmers incomes but I think it actually lead to the recovery in the suckler herd at the time . It was fairly hard to justify when 20% of the meat was going into storage or had to get subsidies to export it to third countries .
I believe Pre Harvest use of Roundup will be restricted in a very short time and spraying it or not for the 2016 harvest will have very little effect .
 
I'm out the door here now and sorry for not responding last night on it.

There is no reason why any poster should be personally castigated for posting any photo of anything that is not illegal at this stage, after all jonny1 just posted to show his lovely crop of wheat (and I doubt any member on here wouldn't like to have it).

That is an excellent post by John earlier today and little to disagree with it. My own view would be a mix of 6600, gone's and Blackwater Boy's but I will say we do very little pre harvest here.

Our own Roundup use is 1l/ac to burn off green cover and between 1.5l/ac and 2l/ac for leas.

It won't be tonight I'd say but I will split these posts out of this thread in the next day or so.
 
I I think everyone should be allowed give their opinion on whatever they want once they back up what they are saying and give their own justification. If people don't agree that's fine, that what a discussion is. I have my opinion on something. It doesn't mean I think everything that person does is wrong. It's not a personal attack, just a comment on a farming practise. Is this not what a farming forum is for?

I'm frustrated with farmers attitudes to glyphosate use. Only 2 months ago everyone was up in arms over the fact people were trying to ban it. I heard countless farners that "it was safe" and "sure just let us have it for out if crop use" and "Ah sure we're probably using too much of it anyway"

The day I made my remarks I had just seen the Teagasc Twitter account advices using glyph to tidy up "a few greens" in spring barley and that probably got me fired up and even more frustrated.

Now that we have another 18 months it's like there's no issue, everyone ignoring the elephant in the room spraying off like crazy. That to me is not how we should be managing the situation.

You can't get away from glyphosate residue being found on people (EVEN IF IT IS TOTALLY HARMLESS) a simple way to rule this out is minimal pre harvest use. Again I'm not saying ban it, if there is a really bad problem fair enough. The poster said "it was the combine they should been in not the sprayer" but still proceeded to spray it off.

I see no point in participating in discussions on here if it just involves us patting each other on the back and telling each other how great we are. If someone critiques someone just suck it up and deal with it. I expect people to critique me.

Times Are very tough at the minute. We need to share ideas, opinions etc that are foreign to what we each already think. It's healthy, it can help us all improve our businesses. I think we should have more heated discussions like this one on here to make it more vibrant and engaging. The reason it's so heated is because it's something that we are passionate about so that's a good thing.

I apologise if my comments were offensive but Again let me assure you they were aimed at the practice and not the person
 
Tippcon said:
That's one of the best posts I've seen on this forum for a long time.
Click to expand...
The witch hunt is called off. I have plenty(well 1 or 2 anyway) of friends that argue with a lot so there's still hope for us going forward. I'm sure you have worked and still work very hard and run a good show.

I want us as an industry to do our best to ensure we give ourselves every chance of continued use of glyph, that is all.

I hadn't seen that Matt Dempsey had written that but I am a bit disappointed. If combining allows me I might just right a letter but I doubt they'll allow it be published....
 
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