Milk replacer experiences this season

[6600]

How did the whole new experience of calving , calf rearing and milking go for you ?

Was it easier or harder than you expected ?

Well it definitely wasn't easier !! The workload just builds and is relentless for a while. Getting easier now the calving is over.

We were well used to calving as changed from sucklers. One advantage is being able to take away the calf which cuts down on the space needed for cows. Also having a ready supply of beestings and hot water is brilliant too.

Kept all the calves, had loads of bulls, all Aubrac and Hereford. Had a few serious issues with big Herefords surprisingly. Never had a whitehead bull before and won't again. Thinking of going with beef bulls again for simplicity.
We fed the calves on whole milk, started them two to a pen and then moved to 12 to a pen 15' * 15'. Two six tits feed each pen. Got a JFC milk cart with pump after a while which cut down a lot on the hardship. Gave them the Halicur for a week in the milk and touch wood haven't had any sickness or bad scour. All the washing of feeders is a pita though.

Milking the heifers as a newbie is not easy, no saying otherwise. I only ever milked once before this. I wouldn't milk for anyone else as there are definitely nicer ways to pass a few hours. Sometimes you would question your sanity but hardship is soon forgotten when you start back at it again the next morning. It seems to be settling down with only one kicker now. We were both milking morning and evening for a long time but that meant nothing else was getting done except milking and we wouldn't be finished till 9pm. Anyway stopped that and now I milk in the morning and Dad does it in the evening.

The weather definitely didn't help and still isn't. Glad to have walls on the parlour and roofs on the sheds. Still have some silage and straw but getting scarce. Would normally have something grazing by day by mid-Feb.
Looking forward to getting them out grazing. Also looking forward to getting builders out of the yard. None of them like doing one job at a time and finishing it. :curse: Started last March and still going on. It would drive you spare.

 

[Ozzy Scott]

Do you just go OAD in a bang or do you reduce the evening feed amount for a while beforehand Bruce?

I usually change over the course of a week, this particular crop of calves are annoying me, so have changed them over in 3 days, dropped the overall rate of powder to 500g/day and fed later and later each day. once they are OAD completely, I will start upping the powder again and go to about 750g day. then again, high levels of powders reduces their meal consumption

 

[Blackwater boy]

Well it definitely wasn't easier !! The workload just builds and is relentless for a while. Getting easier now the calving is over.

We were well used to calving as changed from sucklers. One advantage is being able to take away the calf which cuts down on the space needed for cows. Also having a ready supply of beestings and hot water is brilliant too.

Kept all the calves, had loads of bulls, all Aubrac and Hereford. Had a few serious issues with big Herefords surprisingly. Never had a whitehead bull before and won't again. Thinking of going with beef bulls again for simplicity.
We fed the calves on whole milk, started them two to a pen and then moved to 12 to a pen 15' * 15'. Two six tits feed each pen. Got a JFC milk cart with pump after a while which cut down a lot on the hardship. Gave them the Halicur for a week in the milk and touch wood haven't had any sickness or bad scour. All the washing of feeders is a pita though.

Milking the heifers as a newbie is not easy, no saying otherwise. I only ever milked once before this. I wouldn't milk for anyone else as there are definitely nicer ways to pass a few hours. Sometimes you would question your sanity but hardship is soon forgotten when you start back at it again the next morning. It seems to be settling down with only one kicker now. We were both milking morning and evening for a long time but that meant nothing else was getting done except milking and we wouldn't be finished till 9pm. Anyway stopped that and now I milk in the morning and Dad does it in the evening.

The weather definitely didn't help and still isn't. Glad to have walls on the parlour and roofs on the sheds. Still have some silage and straw but getting scarce. Would normally have something grazing by day by mid-Feb.
Looking forward to getting them out grazing. Also looking forward to getting builders out of the yard. None of them like doing one job at a time and finishing it. :curse: Started last March and still going on. It would drive you spare.

How did you manage to keep your calving so tight? I presume your calving 8 weeks or so? That's serious going and a great start, if they come early and right the first year you have a great foundation going forward.
800 grams of a 22% powder from provimi cargill, 2nd year on it and happy out, not so convinced about the very high protein powders once your feeding enough of it is the main thing. It's amazing the amount of straw calves eat and water they drink once they hit 3 weeks. Only downside is we sold bull calves last Monday in the Mart, €70 they made, possibly the nicest bunch of bull calves we had in years, they were flying it, pity about the price but the lad that bought them will do well as they were very cheap at that for British fresian/Holstein cross.

 

[bruceythom]

Do you just go OAD in a bang or do you reduce the evening feed amount for a while beforehand Bruce?

So fed as per normal this morning, this evening they got half of a OAD feed (approx 350grammes in 1.5litres). On full OAD tomorrow, they'll get 750 grammes as a 3 litre feed.

 

[Ozzy Scott]

So fed as per normal this morning, this evening they got half of a OAD feed (approx 350grammes in 1.5litres). On full OAD tomorrow, they'll get 750 grammes as a 3 litre feed.

can you do it that abrupt ?? taught I was being sharp this time, changing them over 3 days

 

[jf 850]

Well it definitely wasn't easier !! The workload just builds and is relentless for a while. Getting easier now the calving is over.

We were well used to calving as changed from sucklers. One advantage is being able to take away the calf which cuts down on the space needed for cows. Also having a ready supply of beestings and hot water is brilliant too.

Kept all the calves, had loads of bulls, all Aubrac and Hereford. Had a few serious issues with big Herefords surprisingly. Never had a whitehead bull before and won't again. Thinking of going with beef bulls again for simplicity.
We fed the calves on whole milk, started them two to a pen and then moved to 12 to a pen 15' * 15'. Two six tits feed each pen. Got a JFC milk cart with pump after a while which cut down a lot on the hardship. Gave them the Halicur for a week in the milk and touch wood haven't had any sickness or bad scour. All the washing of feeders is a pita though.

Milking the heifers as a newbie is not easy, no saying otherwise. I only ever milked once before this. I wouldn't milk for anyone else as there are definitely nicer ways to pass a few hours. Sometimes you would question your sanity but hardship is soon forgotten when you start back at it again the next morning. It seems to be settling down with only one kicker now. We were both milking morning and evening for a long time but that meant nothing else was getting done except milking and we wouldn't be finished till 9pm. Anyway stopped that and now I milk in the morning and Dad does it in the evening.

The weather definitely didn't help and still isn't. Glad to have walls on the parlour and roofs on the sheds. Still have some silage and straw but getting scarce. Would normally have something grazing by day by mid-Feb.
Looking forward to getting them out grazing. Also looking forward to getting builders out of the yard. None of them like doing one job at a time and finishing it. :curse: Started last March and still going on. It would drive you spare.

A very informative answer @6600. Thank you for that.
As Blackwater boy has said , its great work to get a herd calved as quickly as that , and even more so starting out.
1 more question . Did you buy a herd/herds of mature cows , or God help you if you did , start with a complete herd of heifers ?. I have 2 this year that do not improve my humuor....Evil.
I used to calve a neighbours sucklers for him when he was away working a number of years ago. In calf to a Hereford bull. A huge head , and very little behind that , on the calves. But I just thought him a poor bull. A farmer near here had hardship calving Fr cows after an AA bull this year , and no problem calving the cows in calf to the Limousin.
Are the Aubrac doing well ?

 

[6600]

How did you manage to keep your calving so tight? I presume your calving 8 weeks or so? That's serious going and a great start, if they come early and right the first year you have a great foundation going forward.
800 grams of a 22% powder from provimi cargill, 2nd year on it and happy out, not so convinced about the very high protein powders once your feeding enough of it is the main thing. It's amazing the amount of straw calves eat and water they drink once they hit 3 weeks. Only downside is we sold bull calves last Monday in the Mart, €70 they made, possibly the nicest bunch of bull calves we had in years, they were flying it, pity about the price but the lad that bought them will do well as they were very cheap at that for British fresian/Holstein cross.

3 bulls with 88, took them out after 10 weeks. Swapped around the bulls after 6 weeks. 79 in calf. Fattened the empty ones. That's what we used do with the sucklers. When we started with the sucklers we used try get everything in calf which resulted in it dragging on into May. Bought the heifers from 3 good closed herds. Bolused them too.

Was thinking of buying another 15 for next year rather than put half in calf to AI. Keeps it simple.

 

[bruceythom]

can you do it that abrupt ?? taught I was being sharp this time, changing them over 3 days

Well I don't know if you can, but it's the way we've always done it. But then we do loads of things here that you can't do so don't take it as being right!

 

[bruceythom]

Well it definitely wasn't easier !! The workload just builds and is relentless for a while. Getting easier now the calving is over.

We were well used to calving as changed from sucklers. One advantage is being able to take away the calf which cuts down on the space needed for cows. Also having a ready supply of beestings and hot water is brilliant too.

Kept all the calves, had loads of bulls, all Aubrac and Hereford. Had a few serious issues with big Herefords surprisingly. Never had a whitehead bull before and won't again. Thinking of going with beef bulls again for simplicity.
We fed the calves on whole milk, started them two to a pen and then moved to 12 to a pen 15' * 15'. Two six tits feed each pen. Got a JFC milk cart with pump after a while which cut down a lot on the hardship. Gave them the Halicur for a week in the milk and touch wood haven't had any sickness or bad scour. All the washing of feeders is a pita though.

Milking the heifers as a newbie is not easy, no saying otherwise. I only ever milked once before this. I wouldn't milk for anyone else as there are definitely nicer ways to pass a few hours. Sometimes you would question your sanity but hardship is soon forgotten when you start back at it again the next morning. It seems to be settling down with only one kicker now. We were both milking morning and evening for a long time but that meant nothing else was getting done except milking and we wouldn't be finished till 9pm. Anyway stopped that and now I milk in the morning and Dad does it in the evening.

The weather definitely didn't help and still isn't. Glad to have walls on the parlour and roofs on the sheds. Still have some silage and straw but getting scarce. Would normally have something grazing by day by mid-Feb.
Looking forward to getting them out grazing. Also looking forward to getting builders out of the yard. None of them like doing one job at a time and finishing it. :curse: Started last March and still going on. It would drive you spare.

Fair play, that's good going. I know what it's like having builders around when you're trying to concentrate on calving, it'll be much easier next year.

Did you run heifers through the parlour prior to calving??

 

[6600]

A very informative answer @6600. Thank you for that.
As Blackwater boy has said , its great work to get a herd calved as quickly as that , and even more so starting out.
1 more question . Did you buy a herd/herds of mature cows , or God help you if you did , start with a complete herd of heifers ?. I have 2 this year that do not improve my humuor....Evil.
I used to calve a neighbours sucklers for him when he was away working a number of years ago. In calf to a Hereford bull. A huge head , and very little behind that , on the calves. But I just thought him a poor bull. A farmer near here had hardship calving Fr cows after an AA bull this year , and no problem calving the cows in calf to the Limousin.
Are the Aubrac doing well ?

Thanks, no we went the nuclear option with all heifers. At least we will have a good even herd now. They are on slats and plenty of straw with no sign of mastitis. We bed them with chopped bales in the morning.

We used get on great with the Aubracs on suckler heifers. We already had one and bought another. We didn't chance the Limo or Blonde bulls we already had and sold them and bought a Hereford. Like what you said a massive head and big bones. I always buy a bull based on his size for his age so that probably didn't help. Some of the calves came very big boned and we had trouble. One cow went down for 10 days and another has a scar for her trouble. That poor lady's calf was too heavy to lift. The Hereford calves are getting passed out by the Aubracs the majority of which calve on their own. Lovely lean calves that have a low birth rate. In hindsight we should have stuck to what we knew.

 

[6600]

Fair play, that's good going. I know what it's like having builders around when you're trying to concentrate on calving, it'll be much easier next year.

Did you run heifers through the parlour prior to calving??

Thanks Bruce. We always intended to but didn't have a chance. We had no wash down, feeders, troughs electricity or breast rails until we had 5 calved. The ESB were a big problem as it was well into January before we got hooked up. Were milking them with a bucket plant oad and leaving the calves with them. The first day we milked we had two units working which halved the workload which we thought was great!

I don't know how anyone would go straight from crops to milk. If you have experience with cows and calves already it makes it a lot easier. The money needed alone would be prohibitive unless you wanted to work for the rest of your life to pay for it.

 

[bruceythom]

Thanks Bruce. We always intended to but didn't have a chance. We had no wash down, feeders, troughs electricity or breast rails until we had 5 calved. The ESB were a big problem as it was well into January before we got hooked up. Were milking them with a bucket plant oad and leaving the calves with them. The first day we milked we had two units working which halved the workload which we thought was great!

I don't know how anyone would go straight from crops to milk. If you have experience with cows and calves already it makes it a lot easier. The money needed alone would be prohibitive unless you wanted to work for the rest of your life to pay for it.

Youre Well out of the worst of it now anyway. When the weather settles down the sore arms gained from heifers will be all forgotten. Definitely run the heifers through the parlour next year, you don't need to do it that often or regular. A few runs with a shake of meal in front of them settles them in, it's pure nervousness with them.

Had it all here this year too, but you really don't want anything else going on other than calving when you're at it. Be sure and take a day or so off, don't leave it on the long finger, make your father take one too.
Here's a few tools we have used with kicky animals....

 

[nashmach]

Refreshing to read 6600's honest posts above instead of the usual glamorous stories that are told by the media.:Thumbp2:

 

[kverneland es 80]

Youre Well out of the worst of it now anyway. When the weather settles down the sore arms gained from heifers will be all forgotten. Definitely run the heifers through the parlour next year, you don't need to do it that often or regular. A few runs with a shake of meal in front of them settles them in, it's pure nervousness with them.

Had it all here this year too, but you really don't want anything else going on other than calving when you're at it. Be sure and take a day or so off, don't leave it on the long finger, make your father take one too.
Here's a few tools we have used with kicky animals.... View attachment 52468 View attachment 52469View attachment 52470

the last two are a good job the kick bar is a nono tho

 

[jf 850]

the last two are a good job the kick bar is a nono tho

Totally agree with a kick bar being useless.
Only job is 4 ft of rope and tie her leg to the rail. 2 ropes on 2 legs if she’s bad enough

 

[jcb411abuser]

If you don't have the help I guess tying her leg is the best but if you can get up and lift her tail or squeeze her tail even with your hand after you get the machine on it stops them being as mad. Once the milk starts flowing though I find nearly all of them stand well. If you use any method too much I find it trains them to actually need it to settle, so do your best without if you can so long as you aren't worried about getting injured.

 

[6600]

You're dead right about overusing one method not being a good idea. I always give them a chance before using the clamp. Haven't got a kick bar, the parlour is a SH 2'2" with straight rump bars and troughs. Have a breast rail on a parallel linkage out to the last and an overhead bar so once they are in tight they can't move a whole lot. I suppose sequential bailing would be a savage job but €€. Could be retrofitted in future if necessary I suppose. We made up a moveable backing bar to bring up beside the last cow in an incomplete row. This made an awful difference in that milking became a one person job, if a little slower than with two.

I've only had to tie two, one of the last is a complete nutter but starting to calm down now. This morning I had just two kicking off the clusters and that lovely lady. If I feel myself losing the head I just walk away for a few minutes. The more hardship the steadier and more methodical you need to go. Also we found that if we were getting ridiculous hardship it was usually because we were doing it completely assways!!

Brucey what do you do with the length of pipe? I can only imagine!

Time off has been non-existent but is necessary. Hence the oad calf feeding which started today. Once we got the milking down to once a day for each of us it helped keep the head right. It also shortened the working day a lot. Once a day is enough to be getting broken up. Even getting out to spread a bit of slurry feels like a holiday! I've a bit of ploughing to do which I'm looking forward to a lot..

Fencing and roadways around the yard will be ready to let the ladies out tomorrow thanks be ta f.

 

[Mikey]

I am intrigued about the length of tubing.

If you had 3ltrs of milk replacer and 3ltrs of whole milk, what on paper would be the difference? I’m using 22% protein replacer and wondered how whole milk from the cow compares. What percentage roughly would whole milk be?

My father hates the site of milk replacer but I find calves are easier reared on replacer as the milk is consistent each feed unlike whole milk.

 

[mixed fleet]

I am intrigued about the length of tubing.

If you had 3ltrs of milk replacer and 3ltrs of whole milk, what on paper would be the difference? I’m using 22% protein replacer and wondered how whole milk from the cow compares. What percentage roughly would whole milk be?

My father hates the site of milk replacer but I find calves are easier reared on replacer as the milk is consistent each feed unlike whole milk.

I feeding a 23% protein replacer costing €34/20kg
It recommends 800 grams/day between week 3 to week 7
So a bag feeds 25 calves per day
=€1.36 /calf/day
6 litres of whole milk at a base price of 32 cents
=€1.92/calf/day

 

[Mf310]

You're dead right about overusing one method not being a good idea. I always give them a chance before using the clamp. Haven't got a kick bar, the parlour is a SH 2'2" with straight rump bars and troughs. Have a breast rail on a parallel linkage out to the last and an overhead bar so once they are in tight they can't move a whole lot. I suppose sequential bailing would be a savage job but €€. Could be retrofitted in future if necessary I suppose. We made up a moveable backing bar to bring up beside the last cow in an incomplete row. This made an awful difference in that milking became a one person job, if a little slower than with two.

Also a new entrant with all heifers starting out. 45 out of the 54 calved didnt get as much hardship as we thought we would with them although it made it easier when no more than 3 calved a day. 2 of us in the parlour up to last week only for that we'd be drove insane because when one kicks it off and your still trying to put on the other half of the row and then you have to go back to hold the kicker just makes it alot calmer when 2 of us are milking 1 of us can stay holding a tail while the other milks.. Same as yourself dont own a kickbar .. was using a jumplead clamp at the start for a few heifers but havent had to use it in a week now. The worst hardship we had was at the start of calving we hadnt the parlour finished and the first one calved down on February 2nd ..hand milked for a few days but as more calved we got fairly sick of that so had to buy a 2unit electric plug in mobile milking machine and milked them in the calving gate ... luckily the first 20 that calved were relatively quiet as it wasnt the safest position to be putting on a cluster kneeled down trying to reach in... When parlour got going 2 weeks later we had 21 milking. Parlour felt like a fair luxury after all that. Bought the heifers last march from 3 good herds and aied them for 3 weeks to easy calving freisian and then let off Hereford bull... Will try Ai nearly everything this year as cant be dealing with the trouble we got calving this year. First 33 that calved were all Aied freisian and ud hardly need to watch them all slipped out grand licely calves then we had a weeks break and the rest started coming as herefords .. not so easy on man or animal. They all have required help some alot tougher than others smashing calves but just too hard on the heifers and too hard to watch. Alot to be said for an easy calving proven bull that you know should calve alright rather than a bull that could throw anything. 6600 just on the moveable back bar any chance of a photo just to see it using chain here atm

 

[6600]

Just in out of the snow will put up a picture tomorrow. Are you happy with the milking job? Gets easier most days, am starting to enjoy it. Getting Snapchats of everyone on the beer today can't say I'm too bothered which is unusual for me

 

[dstig]

Also a new entrant with all heifers starting out. 45 out of the 54 calved didnt get as much hardship as we thought we would with them although it made it easier when no more than 3 calved a day. 2 of us in the parlour up to last week only for that we'd be drove insane because when one kicks it off and your still trying to put on the other half of the row and then you have to go back to hold the kicker just makes it alot calmer when 2 of us are milking 1 of us can stay holding a tail while the other milks.. Same as yourself dont own a kickbar .. was using a jumplead clamp at the start for a few heifers but havent had to use it in a week now. The worst hardship we had was at the start of calving we hadnt the parlour finished and the first one calved down on February 2nd ..hand milked for a few days but as more calved we got fairly sick of that so had to buy a 2unit electric plug in mobile milking machine and milked them in the calving gate ... luckily the first 20 that calved were relatively quiet as it wasnt the safest position to be putting on a cluster kneeled down trying to reach in... When parlour got going 2 weeks later we had 21 milking. Parlour felt like a fair luxury after all that. Bought the heifers last march from 3 good herds and aied them for 3 weeks to easy calving freisian and then let off Hereford bull... Will try Ai nearly everything this year as cant be dealing with the trouble we got calving this year. First 33 that calved were all Aied freisian and ud hardly need to watch them all slipped out grand licely calves then we had a weeks break and the rest started coming as herefords .. not so easy on man or animal. They all have required help some alot tougher than others smashing calves but just too hard on the heifers and too hard to watch. Alot to be said for an easy calving proven bull that you know should calve alright rather than a bull that could throw anything. 6600 just on the moveable back bar any chance of a photo just to see it using chain here atm

Oh the joys of heifers all I can say is stick with them! Check out Gentleman agri he makes a few handy things that you might find useful

 

[6600]

Also a new entrant with all heifers starting out. 45 out of the 54 calved didnt get as much hardship as we thought we would with them although it made it easier when no more than 3 calved a day. 2 of us in the parlour up to last week only for that we'd be drove insane because when one kicks it off and your still trying to put on the other half of the row and then you have to go back to hold the kicker just makes it alot calmer when 2 of us are milking 1 of us can stay holding a tail while the other milks.. Same as yourself dont own a kickbar .. was using a jumplead clamp at the start for a few heifers but havent had to use it in a week now. The worst hardship we had was at the start of calving we hadnt the parlour finished and the first one calved down on February 2nd ..hand milked for a few days but as more calved we got fairly sick of that so had to buy a 2unit electric plug in mobile milking machine and milked them in the calving gate ... luckily the first 20 that calved were relatively quiet as it wasnt the safest position to be putting on a cluster kneeled down trying to reach in... When parlour got going 2 weeks later we had 21 milking. Parlour felt like a fair luxury after all that. Bought the heifers last march from 3 good herds and aied them for 3 weeks to easy calving freisian and then let off Hereford bull... Will try Ai nearly everything this year as cant be dealing with the trouble we got calving this year. First 33 that calved were all Aied freisian and ud hardly need to watch them all slipped out grand licely calves then we had a weeks break and the rest started coming as herefords .. not so easy on man or animal. They all have required help some alot tougher than others smashing calves but just too hard on the heifers and too hard to watch. Alot to be said for an easy calving proven bull that you know should calve alright rather than a bull that could throw anything. 6600 just on the moveable back bar any chance of a photo just to see it using chain here atm

Here ya go. It was the only thing we could think of. We don't really have anything on the trough side to put a chain or timber on.

 

[jf 850]

@bruceythom . The lengthy of tube ? What way ?

 

[bruceythom]

View attachment 52551 View attachment 52552 View attachment 52553 View attachment 52554
Here ya go. It was the only thing we could think of. We don't really have anything on the trough side to put a chain or timber on.

The cleanliness of that parlour is a credit to ya, fair play.