fendt

Ptk44 said:
I wonder then will second hand prices stay as high as ever due to low level of supply if a lot people are trading in second hand to buy new?
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New prices won't decrease end of.

I think you may see second hand prices soften a bit but it will be inversely proportional to quality.

Only for TAMS the machinery trade would be banjaxed.

There is an awful lot of tat around though, go and try and find something clean of anything even bog standard stuff and It's impossible.

When you get to the lower value stuff then, the new models from East Europe prop up the trade or put a ceiling on it.
 
nashmach said:
New prices won't decrease end of.

I think you may see second hand prices soften a bit but it will be inversely proportional to quality.

Only for TAMS the machinery trade would be banjaxed.

There is an awful lot of tat around though, go and try and find something clean of anything even bog standard stuff and It's impossible.

When you get to the lower value stuff then, the new models from East Europe prop up the trade or put a ceiling on it.
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Grants are why the prices are so high on a lot of stuff
 
ts115 said:
Pricing a sprayer at the moment, amazing how they all seem to add up to the TAMs reference cost!, the gps section control really pushes the the prices and not really needed for the amount I'd be doing, being honest the prices are just crazy for what your getting!
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nashmach said:
New prices won't decrease end of.

I think you may see second hand prices soften a bit but it will be inversely proportional to quality.

Only for TAMS the machinery trade would be banjaxed.

There is an awful lot of tat around though, go and try and find something clean of anything even bog standard stuff and It's impossible.

When you get to the lower value stuff then, the new models from East Europe prop up the trade or put a ceiling on it.
Click to expand...
As far as I remember, you didn’t have to shop in Ireland to avail of TAMS? It could be interesting to get prices in the U.K. or France if one was considering a bigger ticket item.
 
ts115 said:
Both Berthoud and Amazone, both 21 meter, here's a hardi 18 meter at 37k

suirsprayers.ie

Build your Hardi Master

3 Simple Steps Choose your tank and boom size Add any additional extras Call for delivery date & delivery costs
suirsprayers.ie suirsprayers.ie
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It does seem like an awful lot of money for a general enough sprayer. Powder coated so the paint will probably start lifting after the first year. It would be tempting to buy a clean used machine of possibly better quality abroad.
 
The price of tractors was to do with cheap finance and quantitative easing which allowed the price to rise with freely available money . The overall costs stayed the same as interest fell and prices rose .
Inflation started caused by shortages of materials caused by covid and latterly the war . War is now the dominant factor as it is either plough shares or swords and the swords are winning out as wartime economies predominate . Your Fendt is not competing with John Deere for resources but is competing with Leopard tanks or other military paraphernalia for resources thus keeping prices up and interest high to stop inflation .
I think the days of the ploughmen being sent to the trenches are over but if we enter a twenty year war the resources available to plough with will be limited. If agriculture gets starved of resources by war on one front and climate mitigation on the other HUNGER will be the result.
The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse is the scenario that is facing us .
 
TBF i think the rise in tractor prices has more been down to demand than anything else, the number of tractors sold throughout Europe over the past few years has been way above normal levels and cheap money was a big reason behind it. The rise of interest rates will effect a lot of business' more than on just the cost of tractors, operating loans that were extremely cheap are now getting expensive to keep and it will have many farm business under more pressure, as a man said to me lately, for a long time money was the cheapest thing you could buy!
 
Damo810 said:
TBF i think the rise in tractor prices has more been down to demand than anything else, the number of tractors sold throughout Europe over the past few years has been way above normal levels and cheap money was a big reason behind it. The rise of interest rates will effect a lot of business' more than on just the cost of tractors, operating loans that were extremely cheap are now getting expensive to keep and it will have many farm business under more pressure, as a man said to me lately, for a long time money was the cheapest thing you could buy!
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And a couple of years of high commodity prices
 
Markups have risen massively imo on all products and the massive companies such as tractor manufacturers are making extraordinary profits. Sure inputs have gone up but not to the extent stuff is been marked up.
Supply's been artificially strangled in most sectors too I suspect to exacerbate the impression it's inputs are reason for costs rocketing.

the little guy such as farmers selling grain , mill and meat benifited briefly from the crazy economy last year but this year it's back to the super rich screwing us all.

Capitalism is quickly becoming a failed economy/political model for the majority in most western counteries due to regulators/politicians not reigning in the top 1% power and influence on markets. Slightly off topic rant, apologies probably just jealous I'll never afford a new fendt 🤣
 
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The problem during COVID was any manufacturer was outsourcing components ,example Bosch make ECUs somebody else makes the chips for the ECUs someone else makes the resistors,these are more often than not made in China and India , the two of them got seriously fucked up in COVID , companies making these items just shut down and couldn't be contacted , case rang bosh then so did Deere so did VW so did the vast majority of manufacturers ahhh where are my ecus?
Were having problems sourcing them they were 100 but we've had to put a plan in place to get supply back moving and there now 1,000 case said feck sake okay right ,bosh said oh by the way I can only give you 3 a week now for the moment!!!
They went to all the other suppliers and got the same story .
Thomas went in to order a new tractor because he's own one was fucked , will you order a 300 Optum there for me ? Normally the salesman would move into the house and cook the dinner for you to get that kind of deal .
No sir no can do unless you want to wait for 18 months for it then yes and oh by the way it's 50 grand more than it was two months ago ,
Ah Jesus Christ man what am I going to do my TM isn't fit to pull the 7 furrow plough anymore .
Well we do have an optum here with 3000.
Say no more I'll take it off your hands,send out the finance rep and I'll be down for it next week .
And that went on and on until every dealers yard was empty and they got a fortune for second hand stuff .
Now fast forward to the situation now I'm going in with my Optum to trade it in , my new tractor will be here in a month if I order it , the dealer is shitting himself about taking it in because he has to give me a rob for it ,the next man buying it is going to get absolutely done by the finance company.
There's 4 bald tyres that are going to cost about 15 grand to replace.
What's my Optum worth now? Not a lot and the new one kept climbing.
It's a tricky one to see what will happen
 
johndeere6920s said:
The problem during COVID was any manufacturer was outsourcing components ,example Bosch make ECUs somebody else makes the chips for the ECUs someone else makes the resistors,these are more often than not made in China and India , the two of them got seriously fucked up in COVID , companies making these items just shut down and couldn't be contacted , case rang bosh then so did Deere so did VW so did the vast majority of manufacturers ahhh where are my ecus?
Were having problems sourcing them they were 100 but we've had to put a plan in place to get supply back moving and there now 1,000 case said feck sake okay right ,bosh said oh by the way I can only give you 3 a week now for the moment!!!
They went to all the other suppliers and got the same story .
Thomas went in to order a new tractor because he's own one was fucked , will you order a 300 Optum there for me ? Normally the salesman would move into the house and cook the dinner for you to get that kind of deal .
No sir no can do unless you want to wait for 18 months for it then yes and oh by the way it's 50 grand more than it was two months ago ,
Ah Jesus Christ man what am I going to do my TM isn't fit to pull the 7 furrow plough anymore .
Well we do have an optum here with 3000.
Say no more I'll take it off your hands,send out the finance rep and I'll be down for it next week .
And that went on and on until every dealers yard was empty and they got a fortune for second hand stuff .
Now fast forward to the situation now I'm going in with my Optum to trade it in , my new tractor will be here in a month if I order it , the dealer is shitting himself about taking it in because he has to give me a rob for it ,the next man buying it is going to get absolutely done by the finance company.
There's 4 bald tyres that are going to cost about 15 grand to replace.
What's my Optum worth now? Not a lot and the new one kept climbing.
It's a tricky one to see what will happen
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That sounds like farm machinery has just become a Ponzi scheme

Interesting times lie ahead
 
johndeere6920s said:
The problem during COVID was any manufacturer was outsourcing components ,example Bosch make ECUs somebody else makes the chips for the ECUs someone else makes the resistors,these are more often than not made in China and India , the two of them got seriously fucked up in COVID , companies making these items just shut down and couldn't be contacted , case rang bosh then so did Deere so did VW so did the vast majority of manufacturers ahhh where are my ecus?
Were having problems sourcing them they were 100 but we've had to put a plan in place to get supply back moving and there now 1,000 case said feck sake okay right ,bosh said oh by the way I can only give you 3 a week now for the moment!!!
They went to all the other suppliers and got the same story .
Thomas went in to order a new tractor because he's own one was fucked , will you order a 300 Optum there for me ? Normally the salesman would move into the house and cook the dinner for you to get that kind of deal .
No sir no can do unless you want to wait for 18 months for it then yes and oh by the way it's 50 grand more than it was two months ago ,
Ah Jesus Christ man what am I going to do my TM isn't fit to pull the 7 furrow plough anymore .
Well we do have an optum here with 3000.
Say no more I'll take it off your hands,send out the finance rep and I'll be down for it next week .
And that went on and on until every dealers yard was empty and they got a fortune for second hand stuff .
Now fast forward to the situation now I'm going in with my Optum to trade it in , my new tractor will be here in a month if I order it , the dealer is shitting himself about taking it in because he has to give me a rob for it ,the next man buying it is going to get absolutely done by the finance company.
There's 4 bald tyres that are going to cost about 15 grand to replace.
What's my Optum worth now? Not a lot and the new one kept climbing.
It's a tricky one to see what will happen
Click to expand...
Kieran97 said:
That sounds like farm machinery has just become a Ponzi scheme

Interesting times lie ahead
Click to expand...
 
Bog Man said:
When will artificial intelligence be put into tractors to force the operators to get the best out of the tractor .
Click to expand...
It is already here to some degree. TIM (tractor implement management) will allow the implement control the forward speed of the tractor and there are other features being added that use the ISObus to perform a series of functions for instance drop a knife bank and floor on a baler so it can take in a lump of grass if the slip clutch goes. All this is basically a test bed for autonomous tractors.
 
Merv_B said:
It is already here to some degree. TIM (tractor implement management) will allow the implement control the forward speed of the tractor and there are other features being added that use the ISObus to perform a series of functions for instance drop a knife bank and floor on a baler so it can take in a lump of grass if the slip clutch goes. All this is basically a test bed for autonomous tractors.
Click to expand...
My baler has that function , I don't think we will ever see automation here on a big scale ,it's more suited to where there isn't so many variables
 
c4l said:
I think JD are doing that for their GPS in the US? I remember some video I saw of some lad saying he was paying some amount of money to get full, accurate use of his GPS and how he was changing to a different system. Could be wrong though
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No charge for SF1 but as @drew mentioned a subscription for RTK. They have a new 7000 receiver has 5 year repeatability for no subscription.
 
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