Welding Squares

Just in case any of us didn't spend enough on Fireball squares and tools during their recent Black Friday sale, they have gone and reduced their prices again in time for Christmas. Shame on them, for leading us into temptation!!!!!
 

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Watching this video about welding square box frames. I understand how the square is keeping the two pieces of box flat when he welds the 90% angle pieces. But here when he goes to weld the two pieces together, how is he keeping them flat? I understand he has a shim underneath the other sideto allow for the tabs of the square. But if the floor was uneven, how did he level the other piece up to the clamped piece? Would he have to use a spirit level to make sure both pieces were dead level and shim up if not?

Edit: after watching it about 10 times I can see there is one tab of the square underneath where he tacks the two pieces together. But he doesn't seem to level up the corner that hasn't been welded yet. Could that not lead to a twist?

 
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Used the squares for the first time today. Welding up a square box frame. Haven’t it welded fully, it probably won’t be within fireball’s tolerances but there’s no tolerance around here.

I’m impressed with them but, maybe it’s just inexperience, I think they are made out to be a lot easier to use than they actually are. If you’ve a long length of box and you set it down on the tabs, the weight of length can cause the corner your welding to rise meaning box isn’t resting flush on the tabs and the frame won’t be square.

To counter this I clamped each tab to the box to keep the material at a 90 degrees angle to the Y axis of the square.

I suppose you could shim the other end but then if the table surface isn’t level it could still be out. Am I doing something wrong that I need to do this?

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Used the squares for the first time today. Welding up a square box frame. Haven’t it welded fully, it probably won’t be within fireball’s tolerances but there’s no tolerance around here.

I’m impressed with them but, maybe it’s just inexperience, I think they are made out to be a lot easier to use than they actually are. If you’ve a long length of box and you set it down on the tabs, the weight of length can cause the corner your welding to rise meaning box isn’t resting flush on the tabs and the frame won’t be square.

To counter this I clamped each tab to the box to keep the material at a 90 degrees angle to the Y axis of the square.

I suppose you could shim the other end but then if the table surface isn’t level it could still be out. Am I doing something wrong that I need to do this?

View attachment 132036
I don't think they're intended to be used that way, you're supposed to have a flat surface
 
Used the squares for the first time today. Welding up a square box frame. Haven’t it welded fully, it probably won’t be within fireball’s tolerances but there’s no tolerance around here.

I’m impressed with them but, maybe it’s just inexperience, I think they are made out to be a lot easier to use than they actually are. If you’ve a long length of box and you set it down on the tabs, the weight of length can cause the corner your welding to rise meaning box isn’t resting flush on the tabs and the frame won’t be square.

To counter this I clamped each tab to the box to keep the material at a 90 degrees angle to the Y axis of the square.

I suppose you could shim the other end but then if the table surface isn’t level it could still be out. Am I doing something wrong that I need to do this?

View attachment 132036
I don't think that you are doing anything wrong. It is just a matter of getting a bit of practice with the Fireball squares, just to get used to them and how they work. I have recently bought a few of those Fireball squares, but I haven't had a chance to try them out yet. It will be interesting to see how they work in comparison to the homemade/improvised versions I have been using all along.
I always keep a stock of a dozen or so shims in 1mm, 1.5mm, 2mm and 3mm thicknesses in the bag, with my welding clamps. They are quite useful for dealing with uneven surfaces, or misshapen steel sections.
One point to bear in mind when welding up, such steel frames, is the methodology or sequence for completing the welding, eg, where one starts or finishes a bead of weld. If a frame is slightly off square, depending on where one starts/stops when welding up such frames, can actually help to bring it back square or on the other hand throw it more off square. However, most of the time, for such jobs, it really doesn't matter too much.
 
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I don't think that you are doing anything wrong. It is just a matter of getting a bit of practice with the Fireball squares, just to get used to them and how they work. I have recently bought a few of those Fireball squares, but I haven't had a chance to try them out yet. It will be interesting to see how they work in comparison to the homemade/improvised versions I have been using all along.
I always keep a stock of a dozen or so shims in 1mm, 1.5mm, 2mm and 3mm thicknesses in the bag, with my welding clamps. They are quite useful for dealing with uneven surfaces, or misshapen steel sections.
One point to bear in mind when welding up, such steel frames, is the methodology or sequence for completing the welding, eg, where one starts or finishes a bead of weld. If a frame is slightly off square, depending on where one starts/stops when welding up such frames, can actually help to bring it back square or on the other hand throw it more off square. However, most of the time, for such jobs, it really doesn't matter too much.
Table was clogged up with stuff so I ended up lining it up on top of the sides of a car trailer so that didn't help, a small magnetic level would be handy to use when setting things up. I emailed them and they said that you are supposed to clamp to the tabs if needs be. I'd prefer the mega over the monster, more useful. The fact that you can use the tabs at both sides of the squares is a nice feature.
 
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I was looking at the shims and block kits from fireball tools and I think they would be useful to have. Does anyone have them, are they actually their true size in mm or are they actually sized in inches, the typical American backward way of doing things.
The welding squares are supposed to be 200mm but in reality they are not 200mm, they are 8 inch which is slightly more than 200mm

 
I was looking at the shims and block kits from fireball tools and I think they would be useful to have. Does anyone have them, are they actually their true size in mm or are they actually sized in inches, the typical American backward way of doing things.
The welding squares are supposed to be 200mm but in reality they are not 200mm, they are 8 inch which is slightly more than 200mm

I was actually thinking about buying a set of those Fireball shims and blocks, but they aren't the cheapest.
I have been using my own homemade version for many years. I got a selection of thicknesses of stainless steel (1mm, 2mm, 3mm, 4mm, etc.) cut into strips 60mmx100mm by a neighbour who does a lot of stainless steel work. He cut them from scraps and off cuts for me, so they were relatively cheap to make. I use these regularly, building up the correct thickness required, by putting the correct number/configuration of them together. They work very well and don't rust because they are stainless steel. However, they do need a rub of the flap wheel on the grinder every so often, to remove any bits of weld spatter which may stick to them over time. The ones in the photo currently bear testament to needing a bit of a clean up.
I have a tool bag which currently a bit untidy, which I use to store my shims, clamps, squares, etc. I can grab the bag and go, if I have a job I need them for.
 

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Anyone bought the squares recently? I still haven’t but may do it now. Is it best buy individual ones rather than the set?
 
Anyone bought the squares recently? I still haven’t but may do it now. Is it best buy individual ones rather than the set?

The fabricator package costs €305+v, if you bought them all individually it would be €340+v. Gasweld are in or around the same price as fireball.
 
Anyone bought the squares recently? I still haven’t but may do it now. Is it best buy individual ones rather than the set?
I would wait until the next Fireball sale and buy them then, they would have a sale regularly
 
The fabricator package costs €305+v, if you bought them all individually it would be €340+v. Gasweld are in or around the same price as fireball.
Ye i seen gas weld ones . Alright
I would wait until the next Fireball sale and buy them then, they would have a sale regularly
When will it be i wonder my plan was buy one or two from time to time .
 
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