Wholecrop silage

muckymanor

Well-Known Member
I know nothing about tillage.

We are talking about reseeding a few acres and making wholecrop which will be baled into silage.

Can some of you point me in the right direction so that when i go to the contractor i have some idea of what I'm talking about.

What are the steps involved? Plough, power harrow, seed, fertilize, lime, pick stones, roll???

Could we broadcast the seed?

Anyone recommend what we should put in? Next door has done barley and peas with the grass seed in the past. Is it a good option? They are currently growing kale but have had a very poor crop this year.

How much fertilizer per acre should we put on and what type?

When should it be cut and how many bales to the acre could we expect?

The hope is to winter some stores on the silage over winter.

Thanks in advance.

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I know nothing about tillage.

We are talking about reseeding a few acres and making wholecrop which will be baled into silage.

Can some of you point me in the right direction so that when i go to the contractor i have some idea of what I'm talking about.

What are the steps involved? Plough, power harrow, seed, fertilize, lime, pick stones, roll???

Could we broadcast the seed?

Anyone recommend what we should put in? Next door has done barley and peas with the grass seed in the past. Is it a good option? They are currently growing kale but have had a very poor crop this year.

How much fertilizer per acre should we put on and what type?

When should it be cut and how many bales to the acre could we expect?

The hope is to winter some stores on the silage over winter.

Thanks in advance.

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Best advice I can give you is dont do it

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I put in peas and oats this year and it was a disaster as it rained every day after it was sowed, very poor crop. I did oats only a couple of years ago and it turned out much better, it was cut 13 weeks later but would have been better at 12 weeks, there would have been less grain loss.
I had no bother with rats, I was told to store them in the open in a single row, and to stay away from hedges.
There would be no problem with broad casting it
 
I put in peas and oats this year and it was a disaster as it rained every day after it was sowed, very poor crop. I did oats only a couple of years ago and it turned out much better, it was cut 13 weeks later but would have been better at 12 weeks, there would have been less grain loss.
I had no bother with rats, I was told to store them in the open in a single row, and to stay away from hedges.
There would be no problem with broad casting it
Done it twice for lads both set it and baled it.
You'd want to get the timing bang on or else the grain is too hard and will pass straight though the animal.
The rats are a serious problem too they destroyed most of the bales.
It's expensive enough I tink a good grass seed with clover mix would be better to you

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Am I right in saying your planning to a plant a crop of barley and sow grass at the same time?
Around here we would call that arable silage, it would be planted in April or May around here, I would steer away from a mix that includes peas while it will give protein they are prone to lodging, it can smoother the new grass.
If your balling it, extra wrap is essential, rats can be a huge problem too, we have done many reseed jobs over the years, personally we would not bother with arable silage at home, it's very hard to grow two crops in the same field at the same time.
 
A few things to take in account before you go at it and I'm pretty sure we discussed this before.
Very hard to grow 2 crops at the same time and get the best out of both. You either want grass or barley hard to get both. Set full rate grasseeds and about 4 stone of barley is enough as too much barley takes over. To get the best out of the barley you need it to get to about 3 weeks before combine harvest day as the grain builds starch levels up in the last few weeks this is where the feed value is. You also have a good bit of straw in there which to be fair isn't of much real feed value to weaklings. If you bale it or cut with a mower you may knock grains off, also un processed grain will pass through the animal pretty much undigested so no value, you need the proper wholecrop head and mill/cracker in the harvester but a baler will do nothing. Rats and crows a big problem in bales, the moral of the story is if you want long term grass then go for the grass only. Also if the barley is set too heavy then it can take over and smother the grass in patches then you have a right mess
 
I know nothing about tillage.

We are talking about reseeding a few acres and making wholecrop which will be baled into silage.

Can some of you point me in the right direction so that when i go to the contractor i have some idea of what I'm talking about.

What are the steps involved? Plough, power harrow, seed, fertilize, lime, pick stones, roll???

Could we broadcast the seed?

Anyone recommend what we should put in? Next door has done barley and peas with the grass seed in the past. Is it a good option? They are currently growing kale but have had a very poor crop this year.

How much fertilizer per acre should we put on and what type?

When should it be cut and how many bales to the acre could we expect?

The hope is to winter some stores on the silage over winter.

Thanks in advance.

Sent from my LG-D686 using Tapatalk

ive done it in the past and when reseeding and ive being fairly happy with it.
a few points on it below.
When I reseed ley ground I always roll it after ploughing to avoid bringing the sod up when tilling.I always spend a good bit of time grubbing and levelling it before I sow the grass seed because I find it as important to get the ground ready to sow grassseed as sowing it.
when sowing the arable the arable with the one pass the coulters will be down like when sowing barley and when you sow the grass seed take off the springs.
Roll it after sowing.
id wouldn't use anything other than the onepass to sow grass seed as I find its a great way of sowing grass.
Ive sowed barley,peas and oats before but if sowing again id be only sowing barley and peas. Ive always put it in the pit and buried it in grass so ive no experience of bales really.
the yield wouldn't be as good as you think as the arable will be ripe before the grass is really fit to cut,the last time I sowed it I think id only a load to the acre in yield.
another option.
last summer I mowed a bit of spring barley that wasn't ripenin fast enough and baled it up and I found it as good as the arable silage. I think il try and do the same next year if I can and put it in the pit.
 
ive done it in the past and when reseeding and ive being fairly happy with it.
a few points on it below.
When I reseed ley ground I always roll it after ploughing to avoid bringing the sod up when tilling.I always spend a good bit of time grubbing and levelling it before I sow the grass seed because I find it as important to get the ground ready to sow grassseed as sowing it.
when sowing the arable the arable with the one pass the coulters will be down like when sowing barley and when you sow the grass seed take off the springs.
Roll it after sowing.
id wouldn't use anything other than the onepass to sow grass seed as I find its a great way of sowing grass.
Ive sowed barley,peas and oats before but if sowing again id be only sowing barley and peas. Ive always put it in the pit and buried it in grass so ive no experience of bales really.
the yield wouldn't be as good as you think as the arable will be ripe before the grass is really fit to cut,the last time I sowed it I think id only a load to the acre in yield.
another option.
last summer I mowed a bit of spring barley that wasn't ripenin fast enough and baled it up and I found it as good as the arable silage. I think il try and do the same next year if I can and put it in the pit.
You'd see lads in England just growing barley and no grass cutting it with a harvester.
Seen it in NZ too.
Wagtail is a mighty yoke for grass seed too and the Barrow.
The only time a mower without a conditioner should be used [emoji2]

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You'd see lads in England just growing barley and no grass cutting it with a harvester.
Seen it in NZ too.
Wagtail is a mighty yoke for grass seed too and the Barrow.
The only time a mower without a conditioner should be used [emoji2]

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Well I wouldn't take a present of a grass seed barrow after sowing them for the past few years with the one pass. A far better job I reckon.
 
If indersowing with grass then avoid barley and sow spring wheat, it's a lot more open than barley so no problem with grass being smothered. We have been doing it for years as a way of reseeding grass fields at home sow very few fields direct to grass. You would want to work the field level as you can before sowing generally onepass the wheat here then broadcast the grass in with the grass harrows or with the quad. Lime applied as required either after ploughing or after sowing. Not sure on the rules about broadcasting seed with you over here you aren't allowed to broadcast treated seeds

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Why?

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Well the barrow I used to get out of the coop with seeds was always broke up and I always had to spend a bit of time fixing it up before I went sowing.:thumbdown:
I got in the onepass to sow one day I was stuck and after that I said id never again use the barrow.

I find the onepass way better the power harrow does great work preparing the ground for sowing and the seed always strikes well.men give out about the lines but it wouldn't bother me.
 
Well the barrow I used to get out of the coop with seeds was always broke up and I always had to spend a bit of time fixing it up before I went sowing.[emoji107]
I got in the onepass to sow one day I was stuck and after that I said id never again use the barrow.

I find the onepass way better the power harrow does great work preparing the ground for sowing and the seed always strikes well.men give out about the lines but it wouldn't bother me.

That's the bother with the Barrows alright trying to get them fixed up.
The air drills are alot more accurate than the seed Barrow.
The lines fill out soon enough

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Undersowed here before in 1994, would be very reluctant to do so again.

As BB said, you can't grow two crops and weed control is more difficult as well especially with clover.

I'd be slow to recommend doing arable silage then too.
 
I do triticalle and lupins, sown in April cut in September and field reseeded straight away-well 10 days after round up- in september. Have done it the last few years. It goes in the pit covered with some grass silage. Programme is spray, plough , till ,sow. Pre emergence spray, spray twice during the summer, cut then spray with round up, 2 runs of tiller and sow grass seed and roll. Maize doesnt grow here at all and this works out better for me
 
Undersowed here before in 1994, would be very reluctant to do so again.

As BB said, you can't grow two crops and weed control is more difficult as well especially with clover.

I'd be slow to recommend doing arable silage then too.

I never had a problem with weeds in arable silage anyway.There's a undersown spray that you can get that kills all weeds and keeps the clover.
 
To follow up a bit of this with some more questions.

Has anyone grown Vetch for silage either on its own or as wholecrop with something like oats?
Would love to know if it works well. Have read some great reports on it.
 
Have grown it a few times, once with the peas. Don't use the peas. It's not ideal to bale and wrap it, but if you do, try and leave the bales in single file if at all possible, and lay poison. It'll be the centre bales in a stack the rats will go for. Sowing, whatever way you like, broadcast, drill, whatever. Full rate of grass seed and a max of 5 stone of barley/acre. Fertilise according to soil fertility.
Sow in April. Harvest in August (normally). Mow when the grain is at the cheesy stage, you'll have a window of a week at most.
The ideal mower for the job is a JF CMT 245 with the conditioner removed, but if you can't come on one of these, a conditioner mower operating at a very low speed (have done it at 1100rpm tractor speed) wont do much harm. My next point is imperative, and almost always overlooked, pick up the swards the opposite direction of mowing as travelling the same way as the mower trashes the grain.
We pitted it here, so with the wagon we'd have a few other fields of grass lined up, mixed through the pit and then the top of the pit was grass only, this left it awkward for rats.

I sowed a field of grass only here and then went to sow it undersown for a friend. Similar soil types, same fertiliser, he had more feed on the field when we both harvested our crops.
 
Done it before but only with a pit and grass mixed through and topped off with grass, no experience with baling. Cattle liked it but didn't get it sampled to show the nutrient levels so can't comment on the actual feed value.
 
I know nothing about tillage.

We are talking about reseeding a few acres and making wholecrop which will be baled into silage.

Can some of you point me in the right direction so that when i go to the contractor i have some idea of what I'm talking about.

What are the steps involved? Plough, power harrow, seed, fertilize, lime, pick stones, roll???

Could we broadcast the seed?

Anyone recommend what we should put in? Next door has done barley and peas with the grass seed in the past. Is it a good option? They are currently growing kale but have had a very poor crop this year.

How much fertilizer per acre should we put on and what type?

When should it be cut and how many bales to the acre could we expect?

The hope is to winter some stores on the silage over winter.

Thanks in advance.

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There's whole crop rounds for sale up at Fourmile house if it was any advantage to get a few and see what the quality was like and a chance to speak to the man that made them and see how it went for him.


Cut your way in, weld your way out!!!
 
To rise its head again, what about red clover? Plenty of reading about its advantages for silage on the interweb. Seed is not too expensive. It provides a heavier crop than grass, can be up to 20% protein, would be ideal for feeding weinlings ad lib. It appears that the later varieties of it are suitable for 1 cut silage in mid june and grazing after that.

Anyone got any experience of it or able to give pros and cons?
 
To rise its head again, what about red clover? Plenty of reading about its advantages for silage on the interweb. Seed is not too expensive. It provides a heavier crop than grass, can be up to 20% protein, would be ideal for feeding weinlings ad lib. It appears that the later varieties of it are suitable for 1 cut silage in mid june and grazing after that.

Anyone got any experience of it or able to give pros and cons?
Red clover is good.
Just under sow it with some good hybrid grasses
 
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