Beet Ireland

My comments are made in the absence of any knowledge of the economics of refining sugar in a modern state of the art plant and there’s no doubt that it’s not a license to print money.

I often observe businesses from the outside and wonder how they make enough money to stay afloat. Yet, they do.

So, I’m never going to be one to say that a business can’t work without being in the middle of it myself.
 
Will be interesting to see how this plays out in the UK. As I understand the acreage there is increasing again but British Sugar would have reacted very quickly to price drops in the past...
 
I’d imagine they’ll have to travel to secure the tonnage

I’d say I’ll throw 1k in the hat to help to get the ball rolling.
 
CORK said:
I’d imagine they’ll have to travel to secure the tonnage

I’d say I’ll throw 1k in the hat to help to get the ball rolling.
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Would you be prepared to invest a sizeable amount of money with no guarantee of financial return, and have little or no control over the management of the crop? I think they were talking about an investment of €25k to buy a quota 2 or 3 years ago. I'd be interested to hear people's opinions on it.
 
Tippcon said:
Would you be prepared to invest a sizeable amount of money with no guarantee of financial return, and have little or no control over the management of the crop? I think they were talking about an investment of €25k to buy a quota 2 or 3 years ago. I'd be interested to hear people's opinions on it.
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With investments, the potential reward is usually directly proportional to the risk involved. Winter wheat for example. Shares for example. Winter wheat was painful in 2012. This year we cleared approx €800/acre after inputs and machinery costs.

In terms of the management of the crop, I don’t think it’s in anyone’s interest to manage it badly. Harvest date is probably the most pertinent issue I can think of.

I can’t say if I’d invest in quota or not without more detail, after all I’m a long way from Carlow.

I’ll certainly chance the 1k or a bit more even if I never see it again as I want to support the Irish tillage industry in any way I can.
There was a valuable vegetable production industry in this area. It didn’t move with the times but it made growers a lot of money over the years.
My grandfather was heavily involved in its origins as far as I know. It required grower investment at the beginning also.

The only sure things in this world are death & taxes.
 
CORK said:
With investments, the potential reward is usually directly proportional to the risk involved. Winter wheat for example. Shares for example. Winter wheat was painful in 2012. This year we cleared approx €800/acre after inputs and machinery costs.

In terms of the management of the crop, I don’t think it’s in anyone’s interest to manage it badly. Harvest date is probably the most pertinent issue I can think of.

I can’t say if I’d invest in quota or not without more detail, after all I’m a long way from Carlow.

I’ll certainly chance the 1k or a bit more even if I never see it again as I want to support the Irish tillage industry in any way I can.
There was a valuable vegetable production industry in this area. It didn’t move with the times but it made growers a lot of money over the years.
My grandfather was heavily involved in its origins as far as I know. It required grower investment at the beginning also.

The only sure things in this world are death & taxes.
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With most investments you can make some sort of informed decision on the level of risk involved before you open your cheque book though, I haven't attended any of these meetings to be fair but everything that comes out seems to be very vague. British Sugar have set the price for next year at a little along with £19/t as far as I know, that's a long way off what it would take to break even let alone make a margin over here, sugar prices are on the floor, anaerobic digesters need sizable grants to be feasible. There's talk about bio-polymers in that article but isn't that what Glanbia are at a much more advanced stage of processing at their new plant in Lisheen Mines?
From my reading of it this new beet company will basically have free land to grow and manage their own crop as they see fit, the landowner is carrying all the risk as usual and is playing catch-up from day one. I have no problem in farmers investing in a co-op to process beet if there are proper feasibility studies carried out that suggest it's a viable option, but in this scenario it would appear that the co-op will have no control over the company that is actually managing the whole enterprise. I could be wrong on most of what I'm saying, like I said I'd like to hear more about what way everyone else sees it .
 
Imho the growing looks like a marginal exercise at best. The trick might be in the shareholding but I don't see any info on voting rights etc for the transition to the 3rd company which will finally develop the site and produce product for sale. It is the detail on this that I would like to see. A proposed articles of association on both the co op and final company would be useful. If the model is profitable venture capital will be attracted but I doubt a joint bolshy farmer coop ownership structure would be top of a shopping list for investors. 30mil is a chunk of change.
 
Is It just me getting confused Or has The story changed?

I seem to recall that subsidised transport was mentioned before for the likes of Wexford and Cork growers? The idea being a flat rate regardless of distance? Maybe I'm wrong.

It's also narrowing down the potential pool of growers with 50+ acres now being discussed so you'd need to have 200+ acres In tillage.

From a growing perspective Is It much different to The gluten free oats from Glanbia?

Feeding the Celtic cow Is Going to make this project less feasible In My view with potentially decent returns from fodder beet.
 
CORK said:
With investments, the potential reward is usually directly proportional to the risk involved. Winter wheat for example. Shares for example. Winter wheat was painful in 2012. This year we cleared approx €800/acre after inputs and machinery costs.

In terms of the management of the crop, I don’t think it’s in anyone’s interest to manage it badly. Harvest date is probably the most pertinent issue I can think of.

I can’t say if I’d invest in quota or not without more detail, after all I’m a long way from Carlow.

I’ll certainly chance the 1k or a bit more even if I never see it again as I want to support the Irish tillage industry in any way I can.
There was a valuable vegetable production industry in this area. It didn’t move with the times but it made growers a lot of money over the years.
My grandfather was heavily involved in its origins as far as I know. It required grower investment at the beginning also.

The only sure things in this world are death & taxes.
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I’m more interested in the €800 an acre
After machinery and inputs......
 
"Fortune favours the brave"
In this case l am a yellowbelly coward.
If l could jump into "Doc's" de Lorean and go back to my mid twenties self, maybe l would hold a different opinion , but going on that article , thanks but l am out.
 
CORK said:
4.4tn at 20%mc = €902
Seed bonus less extra seed cost = €70
Straw, 6.1 8x4x3 per acre at €50 = €305
Less cost of €450 per acre = €827/acre.
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lots of dairy farmers would be happy with that margin,and you,ve got your bps payment on top of it but you miss out on the fun of night calving, slurry spreading, downer cows and weekend milking :wink:
 
humungus said:
lots of dairy farmers would be happy with that margin,and you,ve got your bps payment on top of it but you miss out on the fun of night calving, slurry spreading, downer cows and weekend milking :wink:
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And the cash flow and the generally more consistent profitability!!!
 
nashmach said:
I don't know the area at all but is it's location in a very rural area that it is thought planning will be straightforward?

An objection and a trip to Bord Pleanala could easily add 18 months to it.
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There were a few issues when Morrisseys were looking for planning originally so anything is possible. I see lately there is work going on constructing what I'm told is a sand washing plant there, I doubt the locals would be happy if a beet processing plant was also constructed on the site which would bring even more traffic. Another thing that surprises me about the chosen site is the absence of a water source, the old factory had the Barrow along side, the only way I can think of getting water for the new plant would be bore holes.
 
Modern sugar beet factory use the water from the beet itself. It is condensed and reused over and over again.
Sugar Tax and the Celtic cow are the big problems .
 
bagenal said:
There were a few issues when Morrisseys were looking for planning originally so anything is possible. I see lately there is work going on constructing what I'm told is a sand washing plant there, I doubt the locals would be happy if a beet processing plant was also constructed on the site which would bring even more traffic. Another thing that surprises me about the chosen site is the absence of a water source, the old factory had the Barrow along side, the only way I can think of getting water for the new plant would be bore holes.
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Yeah new wash plant gone in. There quarrying that farm. Got a snapchat of the plant last week, serious set up
 
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